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"The greatness of a nation and it's moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated."

Mohandas Ghandi

AMEN!

I only ask how many staff as my concern was how many people would loose their jobs if Saga closed. If you can not ask question's without VERAL ABUSE in return GOD HELP YOU ALL.

Gaz - I'm not going to make any comment on SAGA's accounts or SAGA itself, but what you have just said is absurd. Accounts are intended to be read and interpreted - whole degree courses are run on this - and unless you do so you get absolutely no information from them. The "audit" aspect is restricted in its conclusions - it always is - and it is only based on whatever the accounts themselves say.

The fact that some accounts have been produced (only for the most recent two years of a total of ten that SAGA has been operating) is a major first step, but what the accounts actually say is crucial.

If anyone is interested, I did a quick analysis of aspects of these accounts and have posted that elsewhere. I'll post it here if people want me to.

I don't see anything I have said as being Absurd

1) I said people are already trying to pull the accounting apart

Its a true statement which can be seen on other sites accusations of money missing etc

2.) Its an Independent Audit meaning it was done by an independent accountant in this case M Fox

Thats a true statement too

What is absurd about those 2 points

Gaz

You implied by your wording that there was something wrong or inappropriate in people "pulling the accounting apart", whereas this is an essential and normal part of reading a set of accounts. You get very little information from them if you don't.

And you imply that because the audit was "independent" (all audits are, by definition) nothing could be untoward and nothing requires interpretation. This implication is false. How many people I wonder took the statement about the failure to comply with US tax laws to imply that there could possibly be an outstanding tax credit that SAGA needs to do something about?

There are some oddities about these accounts (not unusual - there are with most published accounts). I wonder how many people have spotted them?

Well Peter its the SAME people pulling the accounting apart they hassle SAGA saying there are no public accounts so SAGA goes ahead and publishes them, and then they start getting a whole new set of accusations thrown at them.

SAGA cant win and its all a bit ridiculous.

Any company accounts can be scrutinized and pulled apart and most have small errors however that should be down to the auditor to identify and correct those after getting the correct information.


Gaz

What accusations have been made concerning the accounts? I haven't seen any, other than Pedro's rather silly and deliberately provocative "these accounts are worthless".

Any errors in the accounts should be identified before the audit certificate is signed and the accounts published. Otherwise what is the point of the audit?

I'm not concerned with errors though. I have just tried to go behind the figures and tease out significant information. What a real accountant is trained to do. Other than one or two minor points I have no criticism of these accounts. Why are you trying to imply that I and others have a "down" on SAGA?

As an accountant and Treasurer of various not-for-profit organizations in Connecticut, the audited figures are better than good.

When you have a charitable organization that ONLY spends 2.4% for promotion and 3.3% for management, you have an exceptionally well run organization. Spending under 10% for those items is almost unheard of...

Obviously there were reporting problems years ago but they seem to have been taken care of with respect to US reporting.

Can you tell me please what happens when a Non Profit Organization makes a profit?