This has proven to be a very useful discussion and I have found reading everyone's views really interesting.

Crockhunter, you are right in saying that 'in theory' if everyone had a tv no one would need to steal them, but given human nature, some people would want more than one TV and so the problem would continue. That said, resources are less valuable when plentiful.

Actually while capitalism has it's drawbacks, theft and crime are still common in communist societies. So we get back to human nature. We also know that genetics, foetal health, child rearing, role models, parenting, peer pressure and a whole host of other issues will determine an individual's willingness to comply with certain laws. And interestingly, most people (outside of the most virtuous and forever may they remain on their pedastal) have a sliding scale of laws they believe should be obeyed. I agree that drugs are a huge problem for society but there is so much big money involved at every level, I doubt much will ever be done to truly resolve the problem on anything other than a local scale.

Jesse I think Lawlucci has elaborated magnificently on this but I will add that there is a host of research done that shows that better education and employment opportunities definitely contribute to a reduction in crime. As Lawlucci also points out, many serious violent crimes are committed in the heat of passion and those are impossible to legislate for. For most people involved in petty crime as young people, boredom, lack of opportunity and adult guidance as well as lack of decent role models are all contributory factors. I realise that it is terribly idealistic looking, but nothing else is working is it?

Denny that reminds me of a Monty Python film.

Capt Jeff - power to the people. I agree with you to a certain extent and if we return to the wild wild west, I'll be one of the first to guard my property in said manner.

Simon, while I understand your views I wouldn't bet that the crime would not be committed again. Death is not a good deterrent. Look at suicide bombers. They are lining up for the job. If you place no value on your life, it doesn't matter if you die for committing a crime. I have spoken to young offenders about this and they say, 'if I get away with it, I'll have more of what I want; if I get caught and sent down, I'll get a roof and three square meals, if I get killed, well my life isn't worth living how it is anyway'. It's easy to say people can make choices about crime but that is only if they have the information necessary to make those choices. Many young people do not feel that they have a choice. If they had good role models they may see other options open to them.

Rykat as you have contributed nothing constructive except being personally offensive, I won't bother replying to you in future.

Now Danny, you make a very good point. What is it with letting people out on bail? I don't get that either.

Seashell that is because their tv's are usually so bloody huge that no one could carry them away anyhow.

Sir Isaac - I have to say that I almost agree with you.

Lawlucci - well presented!

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